Problems opening an app in a tab from the toolbar

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Oct 24, 2008
13
0
#1
The helpfile says "A toolbar button can either open a new tab...", but i'm unable to make tc create new tabs this way. Instead the buttons open up cmd.exe windows.

What went wrong?
 
#2
JP Software Forums" <neil@jpsoft.com>; "odyssey wrote:
| The helpfile says "A toolbar button can either open a new tab...",
| but i'm unable to make tc create new tabs this way. Instead the
| buttons open up cmd.exe windows.
|
| What went wrong?

Firstly, do you mean windows, or did you mean tabs? I noticed that help
topic "toolbardlg.htm" uses "window" in many places where "tab" should be
used. Regardless, the description of "command" tells you that the command
should explicitly specify the program to be run in the new tab. Did you
specify TCC.EXE?
--
HTH, Steve
 

rconn

Administrator
Staff member
May 14, 2008
10,100
85
#3
Steve Fábián wrote:

> JP Software Forums" ; "odyssey wrote:
> | The helpfile says "A toolbar button can either open a new tab...",
> | but i'm unable to make tc create new tabs this way. Instead the
> | buttons open up cmd.exe windows.
> |
> | What went wrong?
>
> Firstly, do you mean windows, or did you mean tabs? I noticed that help
> topic "toolbardlg.htm" uses "window" in many places where "tab" should be
> used.
I don't see any places where that's true. What specifically are you
referring to?

Note that the toolbar buttons will start a separate window for GUI apps
or a new tab window for a console app, so "window" in this case means
either type.

Rex Conn
JP Software
 
Oct 24, 2008
13
0
#5
odyssey wrote:
| The helpfile says "A toolbar button can either open a new tab...",
| but i'm unable to make tc create new tabs this way. Instead the
| buttons open up cmd.exe windows.
|
| What went wrong?

Firstly, do you mean windows, or did you mean tabs? I noticed that help
topic "toolbardlg.ht" uses "window" in many places where "tab" should be
used. Regardless, the description of "command" tells you that the command
should explicitly specify the program to be run in the new tab. Did you
specify TCC.EXE?
--
HTH, Steve
I mean exactly what I wrote. I want to launch a console application (by referring to a bat file that launches it) IN A TAB, and reading the helpfile isn't of much help, since it claims that tabs will be launched. Reading further:
In the Command field, you can enter either the command to be started in a new window ("Start a new window")...
WOW, wait a second, no more mentioning how to launch it in a tab???? It wans't mentioned that it will launch in a window now! And why the heck would I ever WANT it to launch in a window, when I use TC??? I can use windows shortcuts to do that.

Another related thing: I'm almost sure that I was able to launch a few tabs with my application on startup once, but now I'm not anymore? ....or maybe that was with the older TC i downloaded...?

Also there's a bug in the tab-toolbar. If I had previously selected an .ico and removed it afterwards wanting to show text instead, the text does not appear.

...OMFG, WHEN WILL YOU STOP THE ANTISPAM PROCEDURES????? THEY ARE REAAAAAAALLLLYYY ANNOYING!!!!!
 
#6
rconn wrote:
| Steve Fábián wrote:
| ---Quote---
|| odyssey wrote:
||| The helpfile says "A toolbar button can either open a new tab...",
||| but i'm unable to make tc create new tabs this way. Instead the
||| buttons open up cmd.exe windows.
|||
||| What went wrong?
||
|| Firstly, do you mean windows, or did you mean tabs? I noticed that
|| help topic "toolbardlg.htm" uses "window" in many places where "tab"
|| should be used.
| ---End Quote---
| I don't see any places where that's true. What specifically are you
| referring to?
|
| Note that the toolbar buttons will start a separate window for GUI
| apps
| or a new tab window for a console app, so "window" in this case means
| either type.

I have a problem with the phrase "tab window". Tabs and windows are not the
same. For each instance of TCMD there is only one visible window, regardless
of how many tabs are open in that window, or how many of the objects that
Microsoft calls "window" TCMD must deal with to run the display. Each
stand-alone textual or graphical program instance is displayed in a single
window (ignoring pop-ups). There is a major visual distinction between
windows and TCMD tabs. The mechanism a TCMD user needs to create a new tab
or a new window may be identical, but the concepts are different. IMHO the
menu should be changed to indicate "start new tab/window" and HELP should
indicate
1/ starting a graphical program is always in a new window
2/ how to start a new text-mode program in a new tab
3/ how to start a new text-mode program in a new window
--
Steve
 

rconn

Administrator
Staff member
May 14, 2008
10,100
85
#7
Steve Fábián wrote:

> I have a problem with the phrase "tab window". Tabs and windows are not the
> same. For each instance of TCMD there is only one visible window,
> regardless
> of how many tabs are open in that window, or how many of the objects that
> Microsoft calls "window" TCMD must deal with to run the display.
Not necessarily true - you can have multiple tab windows visible at one
time.

A window still exists regardless whether it's fully visible -- a
minimized window on the taskbar still exists, and a non-selected and
(optionally) non-visible tab window still exists (even if only its tab
is visible), and is still running and being updated.

Rex Conn
JP Software
 

rconn

Administrator
Staff member
May 14, 2008
10,100
85
#8
odyssey wrote:

>
> Quote:
> I mean exactly what I wrote. I want to launch a console application (by
> referring to a bat file that launches it) IN A TAB, and reading the
> helpfile isn't of much help, since it claims that tabs will be launched.
If you're specifying a batch file name in the command window, then
Windows will launch whatever app is associated with the batch file
extension(s). If you want to force a particular app to run the batch
file, you need to use that app name. (For example, to start an app
using TCC even when you've defined CMD as the standard batch file
handler: "tcc.exe /c batchname ...")

But it's difficult to give a definitive answer unless you post exactly
what you're entering.


> Reading further:
> WOW, wait a second, no more mentioning how to launch it in a tab???? It
> wans't mentioned that it will launch in a window now! And why the heck
> would I ever WANT it to launch in a window, when I use TC??? I can use
> windows shortcuts to do that.
Console apps will be started in a new tab. Windows GUI apps will be
started in a new window.


> Another related thing: I'm almost sure that I was able to launch a few
> tabs with my application on startup once, but now I'm not anymore?
> ....or maybe that was with the older TC i downloaded...?
You can specify startup tabs in the "Configure Take Command / Tabs" dialog.


> ...OMFG, WHEN WILL YOU STOP THE ANTISPAM PROCEDURES????? THEY ARE
> REAAAAAAALLLLYYY ANNOYING!!!!!
What antispam procedures?

Rex Conn
JP Software
 
#9
rconn wrote:
| Steve Fábián wrote:
|
|
| ---Quote---
|| I have a problem with the phrase "tab window". Tabs and windows are
|| not the same. For each instance of TCMD there is only one visible
|| window, regardless
|| of how many tabs are open in that window, or how many of the objects
|| that Microsoft calls "window" TCMD must deal with to run the display.
| ---End Quote---
| Not necessarily true - you can have multiple tab windows visible at
| one time.

Are you referring to the ability to split TCMD's window into more than one
tab pane? Or to the ability (when enabled through TCMD option dialog) to
have more than one TCMD instance have its own visible window?
|
| A window still exists regardless whether it's fully visible -- a
| minimized window on the taskbar still exists, and a non-selected and
| (optionally) non-visible tab window still exists (even if only its tab
| is visible), and is still running and being updated.

That's what I was referring to as the "Microsft terminology". As far as the
ordinary user is concerned, and here I include myself, but probably should
exclude Vince, TCMD has just one window, which is either minimized or not,
and if not minimized, is visible unless either occluded by another program's
window, or moved to an off-screen area. All those other objects you and MS
calls windows, and the manipulation of which requires the bulk of TCMD's
code, are just internal parts of TCMD. I'd compare it with an automobile
engine - for most it's just "an engine", until something goes wrong, and
even when you go to the mechanic, most people don't know anything about its
details to understand what they are told is faulty.

TCMD users are more sophisticated than the ordinary user - or they would not
have spent money or energy to obtain it. They do understand about the
difference between tabs and independent windows. I know you have spent
thousands of hours to develop their mechanics. Regardless, as a user I don't
care how many visible or invisible windows TCMD must deal with for each tab.
I don't care whether or not their content is updated when not visible. All I
care about is that which is visible, including controlling which program's
operation is currently visible.

For this reason I recommend a strict distinction between panes, tabs, and
windows in the documentation. The term "window" ought to be used only for
objects the user can directly manipulate with mouse or keyboard, minimizing
or maximizing, moving, resizing, closing, etc. I think it would reduce the
number of support requests, whether by direct call or by posts in this NG.
--
Steve
 
Oct 24, 2008
13
0
#10
Okay, so where can I register .bat files to launch with TC? They appearently don't have an "Open with" option as other filetypes. Also, why is this even nessesary, since it wasn't in TCI 2?

I'm annoyed by your anti-spam procedures... First of all registering:
1 Enter content of a scrabled image
2 Enter a verification text
3 Activate a mail
AND!
4 Wait for moderator to accept registration

Most places uses 1 and 3 which seem to work pretty good, but there's NO reason to use *all* possible anti-spam methods!

The worst of all, I just got in one of my initial posts where I quoted something that contained "htm", which the spam-engine detected as a webpage and disallowed me to post it before I had made at least 5 posts! It's rediculous!!!!
 
#11
> I'm annoyed by your anti-spam procedures... First of all registering:
> 1 Enter content of a scrabled image
> 2 Enter a verification text
> 3 Activate a mail
> AND!
> 4 Wait for moderator to accept registration
>
> Most places uses 1 and 3 which seem to work pretty good, but there's NO reason to use *all* possible anti-spam methods!
Since you're a new user, you haven't seen the spam problems that were
caused by people manually following the registrations and then
spamming the group. I understand that it's a frustrating procedure,
but the previous one (using 1 and 3) did not in fact work well at all
here.

--
2008 Fridays: 4/4, 6/6, 8/8, 10/10, 12/12 and 5/9, 9/5, 7/11, 11/7.
Next year they're Saturday.
Measure wealth by the things you have for which you would not take money.
 
#12
JP Software Forums" <neil@jpsoft.com>; "odyssey wrote:
| Okay, so where can I register .bat files to launch with TC? They
| appearently don't have an "Open with" option as other filetypes.

The OS defaults .BAT and .CMD to COMMAND.COM and CMD.EXE, resp.

Use the TCCBATCH.BTM file in your installation directory.

| I'm annoyed by your anti-spam procedures... First of all registering:
| 1 Enter content of a scrabled image
| 2 Enter a verification text
| 3 Activate a mail
| AND!
| 4 Wait for moderator to accept registration
|
| Most places uses 1 and 3 which seem to work pretty good, but there's
| NO reason to use *all* possible anti-spam methods!

I agree with Jim Cook's response. We had entirely too much spam until the
new procedures went into effect.
--
Steve
 

rconn

Administrator
Staff member
May 14, 2008
10,100
85
#13
odyssey wrote:

> Okay, so where can I register .bat files to launch with TC? They
> appearently don't have an "Open with" option as other filetypes. Also,
> why is this even nessesary, since it wasn't in TCI 2?
>
> I'm annoyed by your anti-spam procedures... First of all registering:
> 1 Enter content of a scrabled image
> 2 Enter a verification text
> 3 Activate a mail
> AND!
> 4 Wait for moderator to accept registration
>
> Most places uses 1 and 3 which seem to work pretty good, but there's NO
> reason to use *all* possible anti-spam methods!
Only 2, 3, and 4 are necessary in the forums. #1 was dropped shortly
after #2 was added.

We get over 600 registration attempts a day from spambots, and upwards
of 7000 attempted spam message posts daily. So, there *is* a compelling
reason -- I doubt you would want to read through 7000 spams in order to
find an answer to your post.


> The worst of all, I just got in one of my initial posts where I quoted
> something that contained "htm", which the spam-engine detected as a
> webpage and disallowed me to post it before I had made at least 5 posts!
> It's rediculous!!!!
It's essential, as that knocks out 99.9% of the remaining spam that
makes it through the registration process. Once a user is known to be
valid, the restrictions on posting links is removed.

Rex Conn
JP Software
 
#15
odyssey wrote:
| ---Quote (Originally by odyssey)---
| Okay, so where can I register .bat files to launch with TC? They
| appearently don't have an "Open with" option as other filetypes.
| Also, why is this even nessesary, since it wasn't in TCI 2? ---End
| Quote---
| What about my question?

Read my previous post in this thread.
--
Steve
 

rconn

Administrator
Staff member
May 14, 2008
10,100
85
#16
odyssey wrote:

> ---Quote (Originally by odyssey)---
> Okay, so where can I register .bat files to launch with TC? They
> appearently don't have an "Open with" option as other filetypes.
> Also, why is this even nessesary, since it wasn't in TCI 2?

> ---End Quote---
> What about my question?
It's already been answered -- either configure Windows by running
TCCBATCH, or set the COMSPEC option in the "Configure Take Command /
Tabs" dialog.

(It probably worked in TCI because you'd set the COMSPEC option there.)

Rex Conn
JP Software
 
Oct 24, 2008
13
0
#17
It's already been answered -- either configure Windows by running
TCCBATCH, or set the COMSPEC option in the "Configure Take Command /
Tabs" dialog.
Sorry, I missed that...

Now it opens up as a TC window, I still can't get eigher my buttons or startup tabs to launch as tabs instead of windows.

(It probably worked in TCI because you'd set the COMSPEC option there.)
I know for sure that I haven't set it up, so IF it were set, it was done by installation.

Another thing: Is tccbatch.btm only available for TC - not TCLite?
 

rconn

Administrator
Staff member
May 14, 2008
10,100
85
#18
odyssey wrote:

> ---Quote (Originally by rconn)---
> It's already been answered -- either configure Windows by running
> TCCBATCH, or set the COMSPEC option in the "Configure Take Command /
> Tabs" dialog.
> ---End Quote---
> Sorry, I missed that...
>
> Now it opens up as a TC window, I still can't get eigher my
> buttons or startup tabs to launch as tabs instead of windows.

Unless you tell us *exactly* what you're doing, it's impossible to
determine why it isn't working for you.

Rex Conn
JP Software
 
#20
On Thu, 30 Oct 2008 08:39:38 -0500, "JP Software Forums"
<neil@jpsoft.com>,odyssey <> wrote:


>I'm trying to create startup tabs that will launch my cli application in TABS! Also, i'm trying to create buttons that will launch the same cli application IN TABS.
>
>Title: RB0
>Command: "C:\Documents and Settings\hewi\My Documents\Instanser-bin\RB0.bat"
>
>All other fields empty.
A BTM file is not an app. TCMD must start an app (EXE) in a tab. Use:

Start a new window ... checked.

Command: [path\]TCC.EXE [/C] "C:\Documents and Settings\hewi\My
Documents\Instanser-bin\RB0.bat"

or, if you have COMSPEC set,

Command: %COMSPEC [/C] "C:\Documents and Settings\hewi\My
Documents\Instanser-bin\RB0.bat"

The "/C" (transient) will make the tab close when the BTM file quits.
 
Oct 24, 2008
13
0
#21
i need to launch a bat-file, because my cli application won't run unless it's executed from within it's own directory.

your post is useless - it doesn't explain how i open it in TABS...
 
#22
> i need to launch a bat-file, because my cli application won't run unless it's executed from within it's own directory.
> your post is useless - it doesn't explain how i open it in TABS...
Perhaps I'm not understanding your problem, so please educate me if I
misunderstand.

I made a batch file called test.bat that changes drives and folders to
where a custom program resides. I think this is similar to what you
are trying to do.

I clicked Options \ Configure Tab Toolbar...
I selected an empty tool box.
I set the button label to "Test"
I selected "Send to the current tab"
I put the next line into the Command box, including all quotes just as-is.
"start /tab %comspec% /c d:\test.bat" enter

I Clicked OK to get back to the main window.

When I click the new "Test" tool, it does start a new tab with my
program running in the custom folder.

If this didn't solve your problem, because I've misunderstood, could
you please give detailed examples of each box to check, fill in, etc.,
and I'll try to reproduce your issue and give you the best advice I
can. Showing the contents of your batch file may help.

In reading some of your posts, it seems you want just the batch file
to run in a tab, but unlike programs, Windows itself can not run a
batch file. Batch files are always interpreted by a shell, like
CMD.EXE or COMMAND.COM or 4NT.EXE or TCC.EXE or other available
choices.

In the past, when you were already running a shell like 4NT, you can
then type in the name of a batch file. Since your shell knows what to
do when a batch file name is given, the shell then interprets the
commands in the batch file and you got what you want. When you use
Windows Explorer and double-click a batch file you'll see that it
instead launches CMD.EXE in a box. Try making a batch file that just
says PAUSE and you'll see what I mean.

Just like Windows can only run programs, TCMD needs some program
running in each tab. If you want your batch file to be interpreted by
a shell, as in the past, use the method I've shown here and others
have shown or hinted at, and it will do just what has always been
done.

I hope I've helped.
--
2008 Fridays: 4/4, 6/6, 8/8, 10/10, 12/12 and 5/9, 9/5, 7/11, 11/7.
Next year they're Saturday.
Measure wealth by the things you have for which you would not take money.
 
#23
i need to launch a bat-file, because my cli application won't run unless it's executed from within it's own directory.

your post is useless - it doesn't explain how i open it in TABS...
What is the problem? Do you have a batch file that works correctly if you enter its name with the keyboard in an existing tab.

If not, make one.

If you do, then several persons have said you to configure a tool bar button to start that batch file in a tab.
 
Oct 24, 2008
13
0
#25
I clicked Options \ Configure Tab Toolbar...
I selected an empty tool box.
I set the button label to "Test"
I selected "Send to the current tab"
I put the next line into the Command box, including all quotes just as-is.
"start /tab %comspec% /c d:\test.bat" enter
I put this in Command:
"start /tab %comspec% /c "C:\Documents and Settings\hewi\My Documents\Instanser-bin\RB0.bat"" 13

but I get error:

"A device attached to the system is not functioning. "AttachConsole""

I suspect I will run into problems if I try to launch a button with this command, and the current tab already has launched my application.

I noticed in TCI, that it has a "Start new tab" option. That makes sense if you ask me, instead of these weird hacks.

Also, if I specify my batch file in Properties > Tabs in the tabs, they open up as windows, but appearently through TCC shell. Quite odd, right???
 
Oct 24, 2008
13
0
#26
You don't need a batch file for that; Take Command lets you specify the
startup directory for an app.
Oh yeah, it's almost not buggy... It strips quotes and disregards if the path contains spaces, which ultimatively results in error.

As a GUI side-note, it's illogical that theres no link to the tab toolbar properties when you rightclick a button.
 
May 30, 2008
42
0
#27
From: JP Software Forums [mailto:neil@jpsoft.com]
Sent: Tuesday, October 28, 2008 7:39 AM
Subject: RE: [Support-t-585] Problems opening an app in a tab from the
toolbar


> I have a problem with the phrase "tab window".
This is off-topic, but this makes me think of Google Chrome -- specifically,
how does its design fit into your tabs/windows distinction? :-)

Jonathan Gilbert
 
#28
logic wrote:
| ---Quote---
|| I have a problem with the phrase "tab window".
| ---End Quote---
| This is off-topic, but this makes me think of Google Chrome --
| specifically, how does its design fit into your tabs/windows
| distinction? :-)

No idea what Google Chrome is. I use Firefox as my browser, wherein there is
a strict dichotomy of tabs and windows. Until the phrase appeared in this
thread, I had neither heard nor seen the phrase "tab window".

In my simpleminded logic a window is associated with either a tab-bar or a
system tray icon, and can be resized, moved, minimized, maximized, etc. The
window may be partially or fully occluded by other windows, and it may
occlude other windows. Multiple tabs may exist in a single window, each of
which can be closed without the window itself disappearing, unless the tab
manager has an option to close the window if no tab is active. In this
respect it is irrelevant what the association of programs running is to tabs
or windows.

Some programs I use divide a window into subwindows, and display different
objects therein. In such a case the whole window is still subject to the
same display rules, so that only one part of one subwindow is displayed due
to sizing.

In all of the above situations occlusion of one window by another does not
affect the arrangement of subwindows or tabs within the window.

Other definitions of windows, subwindows and tabs are conceivable. As one
who deals mostly with text, and only occasionally with images (mostly with
photographs) I have not used such programs.
 
May 30, 2008
42
0
#29
From: JP Software Forums [mailto:neil@jpsoft.com]
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 6:55 PM
Subject: RE: [Support-t-585] Problems opening an app in a tab from the
toolbar


>| This is off-topic, but this makes me think of Google Chrome --
>| specifically, how does its design fit into your tabs/windows
>| distinction? :-)
>
>No idea what Google Chrome is. I use Firefox as my browser, wherein there
>is a strict dichotomy of tabs and windows.
Ah :-) You should give Google Chrome a try. It really mixes things up.
Basically, the topmost (outermost) part of the window frame is not a menu or
an array of buttons, but the tab bar. Every tab is self-contained with its
own tool bar and address bar, and tabs can be dragged from one frame to
another. If you pick up a tab and drop it in the middle of nowhere, it makes
a new frame for it on-the-fly.

It's very impressive :-)

Jonathan Gilbert